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Discuss current issues and events happening in the parks.
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Unread post by isinkwe » Fri Oct 18, 2013 12:59 pm

Now this really makes me Image

I have also had the very unpleasant experience of witnessing what these speedsters leave in their wakes.
This unfortunate Bushbuck (between Lower Sabie and Skukuza) must have been hit at a tremendous speed, the poor little thing had bounced twice on the tarmac before it landed in its final resting place.
I don't like posting these , but as said before, if we can show the effects that speeding has , it might help. :hmz:


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Unread post by moobox » Fri Oct 18, 2013 1:11 pm

This is very sad and it makes one angry. But I am smitten with the same feeling of indignation as I am with the poaching story. And I dont believe that a fine is going to stop either of these activities. I'm sorry but I dont have any time for this sort of thing. Put the policing in place and deal with it quick and do whatever needs to be done to make sure that specific individual cant do it again.

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Unread post by Grantmissy » Fri Oct 18, 2013 1:46 pm

This is a human made problem that must be solved by humans. The Management of Kruger need to provide the required leadership and the entire Sanparks workforce should set the example to visitors through disciplined, ethical and proper conduct. Perpetrators and criminals who break the law in Kruger should feel the consequences and they should not be given the opportunity to repeat the same offence again – most of them, if not all of them, will repeat their offences and they will even do more harm if they get the opportunity or are being allowed to do so. These criminals do not belong in Kruger - ban them to enter Kruger again.
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Unread post by johanrebel » Sun Oct 20, 2013 7:36 pm

granny wrote:More traps, more cameras, I don't know the answer.
I do.

Dead simple, not too expensive, nor technically challenging. It is called automated trajectory speed control. A camera at, say, Paul Kruger Gate, registers all passing vehicles. A second camera, at the turn-off to the Skukuza staff village say, then registers again. A computer then calculates the average speed of each vehicle between the two points, and flags all that have exceeded the speed limit. Fining them should not be too hard, as all vehicles will have to leave the park at some point and can be nabbed at the gate.

This system obviously doesn't prevent all speeding, but makes it pointless. A driver who speeds at some point will then have to slow way down or stop for some time to bring his average back below the permitted maximum before reaching the next camera, thus negating any time saved by speeding.

Kruger, with its limited road network and fe intersections is eminently suitable for ATSC, as a relatively small number of cameras will suffice to do the trick.

When it comes to through traffic to and from Mozambique, it is an even simpler matter of time-stamping their entry permit. When leaving the park at the other side, their average speed can easily be calculated, and speeders be fined on the spot.

These two simple methods should suffice to deal with speeding on the busiest tar roads, where no doubt most of the racing occurs, as well as with those categories of visitors most inclined to ignore the speed limits, to whit through traffic, delivery and service vehicles, and staff.

It really isn't that difficult,

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Unread post by propolis » Wed Oct 23, 2013 12:09 am

What is Sanparks / KNP doing about the speeding. I remember many many years ago they use to have speed traps, the guys would go out the same time as the morning drive and then set up the speed trap.

This is very upsetting, we all read the postings, but I am not sure the culprits do not read the forum posts.

So what can really be done?



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Unread post by manicwalker » Wed Oct 23, 2013 2:29 am

What IF "someone" could arrange/donate more speed traps, possibly speed camera's
placed in known speed problem areas...
(that would save the need for constant man power at each trap...)
and all of us donate towards the cost of these traps....
Could both these ideas possibly help just a little??...
While I have no way or ideas of how this could happen,
its really just a thought :hmz:

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Unread post by Koen » Wed Oct 23, 2013 5:46 am

Penny :) I agree with everything you say :shock: :?

This is so important I cant understand it myself either!
Why aren't parks vehicles clearly marked?
Parks vehicles all of them should all have large stickers on the side of both front doors.
I had this problem last time not knowing who was working in the park and who wasn't.
Pure guess work.
Many what look like Kruger vehicles or carrying Kruger workers seem to be speeding.
I dont think this is neccesary or acceptable unless there is an emergency so why aren't they all obeying the same rules?
License to kill or what?
One almost ran us off a dust road near to our bush camp.
I can only assume they were going to the staff quarters as it was near closing time and their vehicle wasn't in the camp later.

Delivery vans are also always always speeding, I've never seen one not speeding.
I also saw a speeding empty bus, then I saw it again packed with children speeding in the opposite direction! What kind of message must that be sending?

This is all unacceptable. I think parks vehicles speeding is possibly the worst simply because it sends a very bad message to other drivers in the park, making them think its OK to speed.
It sets the tone. Parks vehicles should have blocks fitted under the accelerator so they can't go above a certain speed and they should all be very clearly marked as parks vehicles. Absolutely.

P.Hess: Overseas visitors speeding :? They seem to go the slowest from what I've seen, literally crawling along looking into every bush :)
Maybe its local tourists in those rental cars you're seeing? :?

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Unread post by kallis1786 » Wed Oct 23, 2013 9:01 am

Hi People.

This is all very sad :cry: , and our animals should not suffer in their own homes because of our reckless behavior.

There are people that visit the park just to observe the wildlife and therefore these people tend to obey 90% of the rules and than there are cars which are using Kruger Park as a highway, and these people tend to break all the rules, and I have observed this a few times as I mostly enter Punda Gate, there are a lot of cars which zoom past us to reach Pafuri Border Post to go into Mozambique, and these cars dont care even if you at a lion sighting, and I feel these are the biggest culprits, personally up north, I do not know much about the South as am not a frequent visitor in the South, but in the North, this is a major factor in speeding as people only use Kruger as a short cut to go into Mozambique hence not obey traffic rules of the Park.

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Unread post by Koen » Fri Oct 25, 2013 7:11 am

moobox wrote:For me this begs the question: do cars really belong in a game reserve?
It seems logical to me that the first reason is the primary one with the rest being collateral. And if the rest intrude on the primary, then they must be done away with. As a species, we arent playing the game.

Yes it does make you wonder. Im not sure if there is a policy of max number of cars allowed. Think there is for day visitors at busy times.

Certainly it would be ideal not having any cars. Though I think as long as the park has a majority of areas being complete wilderness areas with no road access this is not so bad, think the Kruger manages that.

Unfortunately the park (most) need the revenue to maintain and implement conservation. People on foot even though paying might actualy be more disturbing as animals seem to accept cars mostly but find people as such quite a frightening ordeal.

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Unread post by leander09 » Fri Oct 25, 2013 8:29 am

I think the biggest speedsters is people using it as a short cut or trough way and they are not there to look for game. If you can keep people out that is only using it as a public road a lot of the carnage will end.

To stop it sanparks can make a rule that if you are not overnighting in the park you have to use the same gate to enter and exit on the day. So if you enter at Malelane on the 23rd Oct you have to exit at Malelane on the 23rd Oct.

I do not think that it will be any problem for day visitors or really a inconvenience and it will definitely stop people using it as an autobahn to go through the park from point a to b.

It is just a suggestion but I do think it could help a lot.
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Unread post by Elsa » Fri Oct 25, 2013 9:30 am

The compulsory overnight stop over is already in force and I would hope is being implemented.

1 night in Kruger en route to Moz.

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Unread post by Sheenaugh-Lee » Fri Oct 25, 2013 11:03 am

Well for once I am utterly rendered speechless and im literally bawling my eyes out at the loss of our animals being murdered at the hands of wreckless drivers!! :( I believe that speedtraps should be enforced on as many roads as possible and the whole day not just rush hour! I too have seen plenty speedsters in the park the last one I saw was a Petrol tanker en route to satara well he wasnt just driving fast he was flying he wasnt doing less that 120km/h thats for sure I still said to claud, what will happen if this clown hits an ellie with that tanker it deeply saddens me to think how many more animals will suffer because of negligence! I dont believe that anyone on this site disrespects the rules of the road but if you are one I BEG YOU PLEASE RECONSIDER!!
Im still In LOVE with my Kruger!

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Unread post by propolis » Fri Oct 25, 2013 4:22 pm

Using the Forum to educate, I am all for. Informing schools and the pupils about the dangers of speeding and how we should protect the wildlife is very important, especially about those species on the endangered list and so much more.

That is all good stuff, BUT, its not those sitting behind a steering wheel of the vehicle speeding, doing deliveries, delivering fuel, taking short cuts through the park etc etc.

Its these speeding instances I would like to be seen action taken against now. All the other information given out will eventually filter through, but that takes time.

What happens if a speeding vehicle collides with a pack of wild dogs - that will be disastrous and I love my wild dogs



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Unread post by Koen » Sat Oct 26, 2013 3:47 am

anne-marie wrote:put "sleeping policeman" in the road... those in a hurry have to take road outside, like in all reserves :think:

what a carnage :cry:

It is and it's not something you expect in a National Park, not anywhere in the world. This is a place of refuge. :redface:

Sleeping policeman aren't such a fantastic idea IMO though if done in a certain way they could work for a time.

People are looking for wild life and shouldn't have to worry about obstructions everywhere. On a dust road this is slightly different but you have the choice.
Can you imagine the problems with cars trying to reverse from elephants in a bunch having to then navigate speed bumps backwards etc. I think that's unfair on the majority and probably a bit dangerous too.

Lowish smooth speed bumps that only become a problem over a certain speed would probably be OK. That's to say you can travel at the speed limit but not much over without problems.
These would have to be maintained with regular road works so they don't become too smooth (not something very in vogue for funding in South Africa anywhere at the moment) and would need to be very precisely constructed (at all times) not to be a nuisance or even a danger. To be honest these kind of things don't work for very long under the best conditions.

Unfortunately education at grass roots of our peoples of South Africa is not something the wildlife can wait around for. Installing a national pride and respect for nature in everyone will take many many many years a generation at least of unrelenting focus. While that's important and not entirely impossible the problem is now today.

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Unread post by DinkyBird » Sat Oct 26, 2013 4:41 am

Koen, you said it yesterday yourself:
No one can implement anything in SANparks at any stage without proper and full due process and complete involvement of SANparks anyway.

And that goes for the forums too.

Anyone who feels they have a solution to the speeding problems, needs to work through the correct channels at SANParks, contact the people there and follow the correct protocol and processes.

Once SANParks agrees and gives the go ahead the initiative can be promoted on the forums with pleasure.

We are also here to protect these forums from becoming a place where any organization comes here and asks for their efforts to be promoted, unless they are working in a formal manner in conjunction/partnership with SANParks.

The forum rules are there to protect the forum members and SANParks.

This matter is now closed, and please all get back on topic here :D
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