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Litter, speeding and general lawlessness in Kruger....

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onewithnature
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Re: No respect in Kruger anymore

Unread post by onewithnature » Tue Aug 21, 2012 12:51 am

noeg wrote:So we all blame the people who do not know how to behave. But how should they improve their behaviour? They might find their behaviour normal or might not even know they should behave differently.
We're only complaining and giving examples of bad situations, but what do we do about it.
Seems like we're expecting KPN or the police should solve this problem and we have no part in it


Perhaps people sporting yellow and/or red ribbons should be given a smidgeon more authority for certain transgressions? :hmz: Not to be abused, of course, but to have some way of improving our parks without putting our lives on the line every time we try and get transgressors to improve.
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Re: Video that rule breakers should see

Unread post by Rookie2009 » Tue Aug 21, 2012 7:03 am

Heksie wrote:Eish what happened with the cameraman?
Was he a tourist?


No, it was a guide of a privatre reserve - i definately could not sit in that front seat to track the animals - would be toooo nervous :D
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Re: No respect in Kruger anymore

Unread post by PNF » Tue Aug 21, 2012 7:05 am

Well said, OWN :clap: :clap:
To allow forum members to assist parks personnel would seem to be one way of helping to solve the problem.


noeg wrote:So we all blame the people who do not know how to behave. But how should they improve their behaviour? They might find their behaviour normal or might not even know they should behave differently.
We're only complaining and giving examples of bad situations, but what do we do about it.
Seems like we're expecting KPN or the police should solve this problem and we have no part in it


Noeg, there is no excuse for not reading the regulations and abiding by them. It is just a case of " rules are there to be broken not obeyed"
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Re: No respect in Kruger anymore

Unread post by JenB » Tue Aug 21, 2012 7:26 am

PNF wrote:Well said, OWN :clap: :clap:
To allow forum members to assist parks personnel would seem to be one way of helping to solve the problem.

Forum members can help! :)
Firstly by reporting rule breaking and in case you want to become more involved, join the H.R.'s and volunteer for duty.

An internet connection does not qualify one to have higher authority. One needs to do courses and such which can be done by joining the H.R.'s.
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Re: Video that rule breakers should see

Unread post by DuQues » Tue Aug 21, 2012 11:13 am

Elsa wrote:The Leopard certainly gave enough warning that it wasn't happy with their presence so they can't say they weren't forewarned.

Unmistakable warnings galore indeed.... I would have backed off after the first angry look. Well, I would not have come as close to a feeding animal to start with. That is what you have longer lenses for.
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Re: No respect in Kruger anymore

Unread post by Penny » Tue Aug 21, 2012 12:07 pm

Just as an interesting aside we have on numerous occasions encountered people grossly misbehaving at a sighting and when they have seen the ribbons on our car they have immediately assumed, without us saying anything, that we represent some kind of authority. Other folk have noticed the same thing so its not just something that was a figment of our imagination. Twill be interesting to see the reaction to my rhino sign this year! Its drawn a lot of interest outside courts and loads of people have been genuinely interested in hearing about the rhino's plight and were woefully ignorant of just how bad the situation is!
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Re: No respect in Kruger anymore

Unread post by Crested Val » Tue Aug 21, 2012 12:26 pm

Penny wrote:Just as an interesting aside we have on numerous occasions encountered people grossly misbehaving at a sighting and when they have seen the ribbons on our car they have immediately assumed, without us saying anything, that we represent some kind of authority. Other folk have noticed the same thing so its not just something that was a figment of our imagination. Twill be interesting to see the reaction to my rhino sign this year! Its drawn a lot of interest outside courts and loads of people have been genuinely interested in hearing about the rhino's plight and were woefully ignorant of just how bad the situation is!


Penny, we have also had folk think we are "important people" because of our yellow ribbon. :thumbs_up:
I must also get myself a rhino sign!! :whistle:

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Re: No respect in Kruger anymore

Unread post by noel » Tue Aug 21, 2012 12:36 pm

On my recent trip to KNP, I was at Shitlave dam, having some breakfast (coffee and rusks-fabulous place to have that) when a Toyota sedan pulled up behind me, and next thing I know, a couple get out their car, the lady with a baby (about 9months i'd guess) and the guy with a toddler, and they start walking towards the waters edge, and all the time explaining to the kids what the various animals were (hippos, zebra etc). I was horrified to say the least. So I politely told them that they were not allowed to get out of their vehicles, except at designated places. "What? We did not know that" was the somewhat surprised reply, and they immediately got back into their vehicle, and left. A few questions occured to me:
1. They seemed intent on getting out where ever they stopped, or at such places as Shitlave. Why? Did they not know about the rule to remain in your vehicle except at designated places.
2. Taking a "I'll-give-them-the benefit-of-the-doubt" that they genuinely did not know about the rules of not getting out of your vehicle, why would that be the case? Surely something should have been done about educating visitors about that. They were foreigners (are'nt we all :D ) as I could hear them speaking in some Eureopean language (which will remain anonymous just so we don't offend some), so I give them some credit for that too, as contributing factors to their ignorance. I kept asking myself, which parent in their right minds will risk their precious children like that? Toddler and a baby! I shudder to think what could have happened.
I reckon visitors to the Park should be made to read the rules of the Park as well as the dangers before their entry permit is given. There may be some logistical problems with that such as having it available in other languages. In that case none will be able to plead ignorance and then the law can be enforced with more determination.
I did not report the matter, having given them the benefit of the doubt. But at least I did speak up, with much fear and trepedation.

At Sunset dam, sitting there, some friends happened to meet each other, and next thing you know, they're getting out of their cars warm hugs etc etc. Well you know, expediency and social demands take precedence over rules of the Park. Therein lie many a problem.

I did not say anything or report it-there I am at fault. It was rather upsetting so I left.

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Re: No respect in Kruger anymore

Unread post by Crested Val » Tue Aug 21, 2012 1:09 pm

The more I read on this thread, I am definitely going to try to be more "pro active" with my dealings of the law breakers!!!

I have sometimes reported people in the past, but it has sadly been a bit haphazard, and I have not checked to see the outcome!! :redface:

On my next visit to the park I am going to:-
1. "Politely" remind people not to get out in undesignated areas and also take a photo and report them at the nearest camp.
I will report it to the rangers, as it appears the reception staff don't always act (in all fairness they are usually very busy with their own jobs)

2.I have invested in a "grabber stick" and if I can, I will pick any litter up from the side of the road with it from my seat in the car, because unfortunately most litter is just seen by the side of the road long after it's been dropped, so that is difficult to report the person who threw it.
However if I do see anyone drop litter at a picnic site or camp, I will pick it up, smile sweetly at them and say" Excuse me, but I think you dropped this".

3.Unfortuately speeding is even more difficult to report, as it is only your word. Even if you take their number, you can't prove their speed. So any suggestions here, as to how I can help, will be gratefully received!!

Wish me luck.............and watch this space!!! :dance:

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Re: No respect in Kruger anymore

Unread post by DrPhil » Tue Aug 21, 2012 1:20 pm

Last time we entered Phalaborwa, in march, I had to sign a indemnity form. The reception guy told me it is due to the large amount of law breakers and the park making sure it is not legaly responsible for the safety of tourists.

This was the first time I had to sign such a form upon entering. Could this be a reason why people get out as they feel they take responsibility, and now they can do what they want. :hmz:

Maybe the form should also have a fines table on it, where you have to sign and accept the consequences if you transgress from the rules? :think: This might get visitors to read the rules and not just put it in the car until they reach the first camp to check in.

maybe the punishment should be a baseball bat to the knees instead of a fine
Last edited by DrPhil on Tue Aug 21, 2012 1:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: No respect in Kruger anymore

Unread post by DrPhil » Tue Aug 21, 2012 1:25 pm

Crested Val wrote:3.Unfortuately speeding is even more difficult to report, as it is only your word. Even if you take their number, you can't prove their speed. So any suggestions here, as to how I can help, will be gratefully received!!

Wish me luck.............and watch this space!!! :dance:


If you have a video camera you could speed-up to the limit and take a short clip of the car moving away from you with your speedometer in the shot as well. Don't know if this will be accepted but it will be prove. :thumbs_up:
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Re: No respect in Kruger anymore

Unread post by Crested Val » Tue Aug 21, 2012 1:27 pm

DrPhil wrote:
Crested Val wrote:3.Unfortuately speeding is even more difficult to report, as it is only your word. Even if you take their number, you can't prove their speed. So any suggestions here, as to how I can help, will be gratefully received!!

Wish me luck.............and watch this space!!! :dance:


If you have a video camera you could speed-up to the limit and take a short clip of the car moving away from you with your speedometer in the shot as well. Don't know if this will be accepted but it will be prove. :thumbs_up:


Worth thinking about!! :thumbs_up:

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Re: No respect in Kruger anymore

Unread post by Crested Val » Tue Aug 21, 2012 1:37 pm

I've just re read Dr Phil's post, and I think he has a point. :thumbs_up:

If we could be given a separate form with the entry permit, and on it was written (in big letters) the fines that will be implemented, for the various transgressions.

The forms would cost very little to produce, but the good that they may do, would be wonderful.

Sort of thing I'm talking about.

On SANParks headed paper.

Introductory blurb.

SPEEDING - Fine R******

LITTERING - Fine R*****

GETTING OUT OF VEHICLE - Fine R****


Perhaps I'm being too unrealistic, but I think it would at least make people think before they break the rules. :hmz:

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Re: No respect in Kruger anymore

Unread post by Thebi » Tue Aug 21, 2012 1:51 pm

[quote="noeg"]
Don't wait to long yourself, but make way for others or tell that what you see yourself.
etc, etc.

I am happy to tell others what I am viewing but as I go to the Kruger to take photos it is impossible for me to "move along" . I always park in such a way that i do not obstruct the traffice flow. I once spent three days at a lion kill.

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Re: No respect in Kruger anymore

Unread post by PetraJ » Tue Aug 21, 2012 2:41 pm

The new indemnity form is now at every gate. Every person in the vehicle that is over the age of 18 must sign this form. :thumbs_up:


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