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 Post subject: Re: Karoo Lions
Unread postPosted: Tue Feb 01, 2011 4:34 pm 
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Hi Addo

Well then I have to agree with Jonjon. That had to be checked befor the Lions were introduced. But well that is only my oppinion. Because Lions will change the Destination somehow. And If Jonjon tells the truth that so many People hike causing problems. In my Oppinion to check if it is an hiking destinatiobn or not can be checked easily in my oppinion . To do a survey shouldn´t be a big deal. And Statistic Programms exist best example is SPSS. I worked with it and you can get quite quick valid Results.

To avoid missunderstandings I really enjoy that Lions occur in Karoo again. But now the oppinion of Jonjon made sense. Because if this NP is really a hiking Paradise you could easily develop to a hiking destination. But well I belive SANP know what they are doing.

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 Post subject: Re: Karoo Lions
Unread postPosted: Tue Feb 01, 2011 6:46 pm 
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Location: Port Elizabeth
Hi Malealea
There is a hiking club in Beaufort West that will take tourists with them when they hike in and around Beaufort West so for me it is not such a big deal like I said I will now only take shorter routes +/- 10 -15 km. day hikes. I will be in the Karoo Park very soon and I will enjoy every minute of it but dont expect to see too much wildlife because half the park is not accessable to me because I do not have a 4x4. (The Fossil Trail is only 300 metres long paved footpath) Sorry I promise this will be my very last post on this subject


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 Post subject: Re: Karoo Lions
Unread postPosted: Tue Feb 01, 2011 7:18 pm 
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@ Jonjon,

I like to encourage you to carry on. I really enjopy the discussion with you. Your Style to debatte in particular. You raise your voice wiothout getting to personal.

Does the Hiking Club organsied in former days hikes in Karoo NP? Because that will give us a clue how many Hikers visited the park for Hiking purpose. As I wrote earlier times, that this matter have not been checked is really intresting. Because the matter occurs in that Forum. I expeckt If a Stattement like yours occur that this have been checked. If your stattement have a great Value than we could discuss how to carry on. Now they broke the step, the Stakeholders were indeed petermitted. That shouldn´t be. Now In understand you to 100% Evenso I still disagree. I really hope you answer.

Best Regards

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 Post subject: Re: Karoo Lions
Unread postPosted: Thu Feb 03, 2011 9:04 pm 
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Location: Kleinmond, Western Cape
I slept over in the park on 23 & 26 January. I had a nice long conversation with Brian van der Westhuizen on the morning of 24 January. Up till then, the last time lions were seen in the park by tourists was in the Pienaar's Pass (4x4 route) a while ago.

The two males are "inspecting" and "marking" the whole park and meet up with the females and cubs from time to time. Lion faeces (most probably of the males) were to be seen on the tar road between the gate and rest camp - actually between the gate and the first speed bump. Brian drew my attention to it.

This time we had no luck with the lions, but still enjoyed another fantastic visit to "our farm" (as my SO and I refer to the park).

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 Post subject: Re: Karoo Lions
Unread postPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 11:40 pm 
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hmm that is intresting. Till noew does any accidents arte reported? And how is the Impackt of lions? Tghat´ll ne intresting. As Far as i know they don´t hasve a bifg impackt.
Addo can you confirm it?

I just vhave another question. Leopards spread heavily at the moment. Did Leopards have been rekorded in the last five years. If yes how many times?

BEST REGARDS

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 Post subject: Re: Karoo Lions
Unread postPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 11:37 am 
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As far as I know, leopards have not been recorded within the Park boundaries but we suspect that they may occur there even though we have no physical evidence of it.

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 Post subject: lions back in the karoo national park
Unread postPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:57 pm 
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Good to hear that the sanparks are reversing the situation with respect to the lion population ; i have this sense that in the 1800's there must have been a free for all , from the records it appears that not much escaped the hunters those days ; currently there are of course still concessions going for lion hunting in the kalahari and in many other areas in africa ,despite that male lion population is rapidly falling ; however the so called overseas hunters who most of the time shoot from blinds at baited lions are still allowed to come and shoot as they please maily because hunting is still allowed along with the demand for their usd's; national geographic Dericke Joubert estimates that 550 trophies are exported from africa then the scientific studies point to the need of compensating the rural populations (like in kenya) who traditionally kill lions as part of their culture (initiation in manhood?); well i would say stop the legal hunting of male lions in africa by the so called last of the great white hunters and easily get to a quick win situation ; i don't need to have a phd degree to understand that it is simple arithmetic ! so well done to sanparks that after 170 years and all the excesses and shortsighted hunting of the 1800's hunters we have again lions in the area!
By the way i am not even part of any animal walfare society , i am simply a dedicated hunter and rather prefer venison and biltong to lion meat.

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 Post subject: Re: lions back in the karoo national park
Unread postPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2011 3:10 pm 
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@ Joao,

There is already a Lion Thread, which is only two zhreads below yours. About hunting, I think you are half right. All human beeings should stop hunting Predators (doesn´t matter if you are black or white, European or African etc.). With the reintroducktion it isn´t easy at all. Of course the may occur traditionally, but Karoo was a former hiking destination. So we always have two sides of the medal. I like to envorage you join the discussion in "Karoo Lions".

Cu

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 Post subject: Re: Karoo Lions
Unread postPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 12:13 pm 
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Location: Port Elizabeth
How many prides can the Karoo Park support and when it reaches this number what will happen to the rest?


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 Post subject: Re: Karoo Lions
Unread postPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 3:24 pm 
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Location: Edenvale, Johannesburg
jad wrote:
How many prides can the Karoo Park support and when it reaches this number what will happen to the rest?


They estimated 15-20 Lions, when the population reaches 20 they will assess how many Lions the park can actually hold... They will probably move them to another reserve or np when there become too many Lions but this is still a long way off!


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 Post subject: Re: Karoo Lions
Unread postPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2011 2:47 pm 
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Location: Brackenfell, Western Cape
Any news on the latest whereabouts of the lions at Karoo National Park ?

Lennie


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 Post subject: Re: Karoo Lions
Unread postPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 3:17 pm 
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I was in Karoo National Park in the first week of March and the two male lions were resident in the Lammertjiesleegte area while the lionesses and cubs had moved into the remote Mountain view area (not close to any roads).

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 Post subject: Re: lions back in the karoo national park
Unread postPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 3:32 pm 
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jfelizardo wrote:
national geographic Dericke Joubert estimates that 550 trophies are exported from africa then the scientific studies point to the need of compensating the rural populations (like in kenya) who traditionally kill lions as part of their culture (initiation in manhood?);


The tradition of killing a male lion, exclusively by the Maasai, as an initiation to manhood was topped in the 50-60's. Hunting of lions using bait is still done in Tanzania.

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 Post subject: Re: Karoo Lions
Unread postPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 11:37 am 
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Hi Megan,

Just wondered, will you be giving us a family tree with the Karoo lions as you did with Addo?

What are the names of our Karoo friens, i know one is Nossob and I think the other one Bitterbal, but i'm not sure, will you please let us know? :pray:

Kind Regards :D

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 Post subject: Re: Karoo Lions
Unread postPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 1:36 pm 
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The males names are Nossob and Bitterbal and the lionesses are Kamkwa and Megan. Nossob, Bitterbal and Kamkwa are 3 of the original 6 lions that were translocated from the Kgalagadi to Addo in 2003....so they have been on quite some journey :)

As far as I know, the four cubs (2 males, 2 females) haven't been named yet but will check this.

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