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 Post subject: Re: Paleoanthropology Quiz (QM)
Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 12:31 am 
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So TP, are you saying that Cro-Magnons were merely one of the earliest communities of Homo sapiens to migrate into Europe, that they were not a separate species. They were a population. If this is the case they probably have no descendants, since an ice age overcame Europe, and the Neanderthals, who were better suited to frigid weather, migrated to the continent and took over for a while, and all of them just evolved from one into the other, survival of the fittest kind of thing?

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 Post subject: Re: Paleoanthropology Quiz (QM)
Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 1:16 am 
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Siobain, what I'm suggesting is that the evolutionary direction that occurred with H.erectus probably took two paths - one that led to Neanderthal in Europe and the other that led eventually to Cro-Magnon who then spread out of Africa and Asia into Europe.

The glaciation in Europe may have led evolution into one path whereas the environment in Africa / Asia may have taken the evolutionary process down another path. Bear in mind that "between" H.erectus and H.sapiens there are a couple of other "species" followed by the archaic humans, which fit into the same timeline as Neanderthal.

So, if I had to draw a timeline it would be something like H.erectus evolving into small groups of H.heidelbergensis which evolved into H.neanderthalensis in Europe and into H.sapiens in Africa / Asia. H.sapiens evolved into AMH.

H.sapiens then migrated from Africa / Asia into Europe and with their different developments regarding usage of their brain they displaced H.neanderthalensis which was a branch of the tree that had not worked.

Food for thought?

Just for information there has been another rather exciting discovery in SA in paleoanthropology: Nat Geo online article

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 Post subject: Re: Paleoanthropology Quiz (QM)
Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 1:17 am 
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See, though they say that all of modern humans have the same genetics - it is only the phenotype (i.e. physical appearance) that differs - there is diversity amongst current races. For example, it is well known that negroids have more robust skulls, while the caucasian skull is generally thinner. This, to me, suggests that some different races maybe derived from different ancestors - especially as various human ancestors did originate in certain areas of the planet. I wonder if we don't all derive from more than one branch of the tree?

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 Post subject: Re: Paleoanthropology Quiz (QM)
Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 1:19 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Paleoanthropology Quiz (QM)
Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 1:22 am 
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Thanks, TP: wonderful discovery to be sure! Should throw everything topsy-turvy yet again. :hmz:

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 Post subject: Re: Paleoanthropology Quiz (QM)
Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 1:38 am 
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Thanks TP! As OWN says, a great discovery. A little more to throw into the melting pot.

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 Post subject: Re: Paleoanthropology Quiz (QM)
Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 3:49 am 
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Siobain & OWN, this appears to have already got debate going in the community! :big_eyes:

OWN, I think we have all evolved from a common source, something like H.erectus, but because of the environment in which the evolutionary process has occurred, physical differences have developed.

I would love to have seen what would have happened if any large number of hominids had been present in Australia before it broke away. For some reason, maybe because of it's isolation - never joined to the mainland once the breakaway occurred - mammals did not evolve beyond the marsupial stage which is fairly early in the evolutionary chain. Maybe because of the size of the continent and the lack of threat from other evolving communities, there was no need for any further evolution? Let's say an early hominid had been isolated on the continent - would they have had a need to evolve any further?

They probably would have, given there were some largish marsupial predators, they would have had to evolve as little - but once they had reached the point where they were a match for the predators - would they have evolved any further?

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 Post subject: Re: Paleoanthropology Quiz (QM)
Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 8:48 am 
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Interesting about this new find! Didn't watch any news last night, so only caught the tail end of a discussion on the radio this morning. As soon as I got to work I started search. Thanks for the NatGeo link TP! :thumbs_up:

Some thought-provoking comments on the Australian angle, what would have happened had early hominids been trapped there. But I am sure that they would have evolved more in any case. Maybe not as far, or rather in the same direction and manner, as those in other areas of the earth, as those had other challenges to contend with. But evolved they would have. Why, even us humans today are still evolving, adapting to our environment. Though our environment is changing (by US!) far faster than we can evolve to adapt to it, but evolving we surely are.

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 Post subject: Re: Paleoanthropology Quiz (QM)
Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 9:12 am 
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You're welcome B3006. :thumbs_up:

I don't disagree with your comment about continuous evolution :thumbs_up: . It would have been interesting though to see how far a hominid would have evolved in an isolated continent prior to the arrival of AMH about 50,000 years ago. Would they have found a hominid that was even as evolved as H.erectus - I don't believe they would have personally.

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 Post subject: Re: Paleoanthropology Quiz (QM)
Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 9:40 am 
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So, you're saying that Australians would have been inferior? :big_eyes: :big_eyes: :twisted: :twisted: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Interesting that you believe we all come from one common ancestor. It makes perfect sense of course, and I can see how the environmental challenges may have led to physical differences. I wonder, though, if that explains all of the physical differences? :hmz:

Then again, if you want to throw a whole new angle on things - and mostly not scientific, for it is rooted in hypothesis - we can talk about Erich von Daniken's assertions, and "proofs", that certain races on Earth developed directly from highly-evolved aliens that landed here many moons ago, and were miscegenated into early man! But that would really throw things into turmoil; although, I still hold this as a possibility in our evolutionary processes.

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 Post subject: Re: Paleoanthropology Quiz (QM)
Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 9:46 am 
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Quote:
So, you're saying that Australians would have been inferior?
Well spotted OWN, exactly :twisted: :wink: :lol:

I would'nt discount that either OWN, there are too many "weird" artifacts around the world that could support his hypothesis. However, because our DNA is such a close match to, say, a chimpanzee's they would also have had to have some hanky panky there as well :wink: :whistle:

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 Post subject: Re: Paleoanthropology Quiz (QM)
Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 9:54 am 
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:funny: :funny: all around!

Yes, there are many weird finds that just cannot be explained by levels of technology during the age of the artefacts! There are many, many such examples ... and, as I always say, it takes only one of these to be true for the whole of human assumptions and hypotheses to be turned on its head.
Of course, there is every possibility that, because most of the universe is composed of the same basic elements - and therefore intelligent life anywhere is most likely to be similar to us - the genetic composition of aliens could be surprisingly similar to ours too; and therefore of chimpanzees. If you understand the magnificent chemical possibilities of carbon, hydrogen, and oxygen bonds, you begin to realise that other elements would not be anywhere as efficient if used to create living tissue anywhere in the universe!
But, I'm all for the hanky-panky theory. After all, what else could you do on a primitive earth to keep yourselves occupied? :twisted: :twisted:

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 Post subject: Re: Paleoanthropology Quiz (QM)
Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 10:26 am 
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Von Däniken! Bachdad battery... steel tower... round balls... Nazca... Peri Reis... etc. etc. etc. Interesting thoughts OWN and TP!

But, in the end, I still believe in the Creation. But I find this paleonthology discussion very interesting.

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 Post subject: Re: Paleoanthropology Quiz (QM)
Unread postPosted: Fri Apr 09, 2010 5:58 pm 
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Paleoanthropology got front page on the news
tabloids today. It even overpowered other current
political drama and nonsense currently happening and
therefore must have some significance about it.
Almost a complete front page!
I did not manage to read the whole article but there is talk of the missing link. The link between ape and
man?

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 Post subject: Re: Paleoanthropology Quiz (QM)
Unread postPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2010 5:01 am 
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Bishop, onr of the things I appreciate about you is that you're always willing to look at things from new angles: and that is why your knowledge and understanding of things is so extensive. :clap: :clap: :clap: Thanks for reminding me of the specifics of von Daniken (I can't do that two-dot thing on the "a" :wall: ) - the Baghdad battery, and other amazing articles, are a source of eternal wonderment for me!

H. Erectus, I believe the missing-link has been suggested in almost any major paleoanthropological discovery of the last who-knows-how-many decades! This is no different. But, hopefully THIS ONE WILL BE THE ONE! :pray: :pray:
What is great is that the subject is receiving so much publicity - and that is good for paleoanthropology in general!

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