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 Post subject: Re: selfish people
Unread postPosted: Fri May 21, 2010 6:19 pm 
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Legendary Virtual Ranger
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Location: Back home in the caravan at Malelane camp, KNP
It is important to note that the rules state that at sightings you should park on the side of the road with the sighting so others do not ruin your sighting by driving between you and whatever it is.
Also the lane opposite the sighting MUST BE KEPT FREE for those who need/want to drive past.
If everyone did this then a lot of the problems mentioned above would be avoided.

I also fully agree that it is extremely selfish to 'hog' a sighting just because you were there first (or almost first) and have the time to do so.
Drive on and come back again a little later maybe if it is a pride of lions doing very little.

If the animals are on the move then drop back and allow someone else to take first place for a while, or even slowly and gently edge past them - it is usually possible if done with care.

And NEVER park across the road to block it completely and also spoil the views of others behind you!

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 Post subject: Re: selfish people
Unread postPosted: Fri May 21, 2010 7:59 pm 
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I agree 100% with you EJ!! :clap:
For me it is extremely selfish for the "first visitors" at a sighting to expect that everybody else, way behind seeing nothing, should stay put till the "first visitors" had their oooohhhs and aaaahhhs while blocking the road!

Come on people, take your pics and give everybody a chance as well! :thumbs_up:


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 Post subject: Re: selfish people
Unread postPosted: Fri May 21, 2010 9:20 pm 
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So, if everybody followed the sighting rules of keeping a lane open as EJ has pointed out, there wouldn't be a problem. :thumbs_up:

Now if only we can change human nature. :tongue:

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 Post subject: Re: selfish people
Unread postPosted: Sat May 22, 2010 5:50 am 
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Legendary Virtual Ranger
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The rules are clearly stated on the leaflet given to everyone with their permit - if only people would read it a lot of problems would be avoided!

_________________
Smiling is contagious. Start an epidemic today!

Have you read the gate leaflet? Do you KNOW the regulations?

Completed over 5 years in Kruger in my caravan.

If I were normal I wouldn't be me!


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 Post subject: Re: selfish people
Unread postPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 8:36 am 
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I must admit, I am very conscious of delaying at a sighting and have probably missed out on a lot of good goings on, but that's the luck of the draw.
If I'm the only vehicle there, I'll stay put to enjoy, but as soon as other people arrive and one of them is having a problem seeing because of his/her position, I move on.
Too many people sit for too long and to heck with others piling up around the sighting waiting their turn.
Here's a question....you arrive at a sighting where there are say 20 cars ahead of you.
Where you are, you can't see a thing.
You sit tight waiting your turn until you calculate that by the time you get to be in a position to see anything half the day will have passed or whatever is of interest will have moved off with all the activity anyway.
Do you think to yourself "I'll just sit here forever so as not to spoil anything", or do you try to move on very very carefully so that the people hogging the sighting don't end up spoiling the rest of your day because you were unable to get to the places you wanted to go to for the day and possible future sightings?


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 Post subject: Re: selfish people
Unread postPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 8:47 am 
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Legendary Virtual Ranger
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Location: Back home in the caravan at Malelane camp, KNP
If I see a large number of cars I get past as quickly as possible (moving slowly of course!).
There are plenty of stories to show that these jams upset the animals and can lead to tragedies (Lower Sabie at least twice recently for example).
Often that has led to even better sightings.......a lion jam with lions way off in the river bed and when I moved off a leopard on the road all to myself for several minutes is just one example.

And when traveling with the caravan I only stop when no other cars are there.

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Smiling is contagious. Start an epidemic today!

Have you read the gate leaflet? Do you KNOW the regulations?

Completed over 5 years in Kruger in my caravan.

If I were normal I wouldn't be me!


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 Post subject: Re: selfish people
Unread postPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 9:23 am 
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what is the rule finally?
park on the sighting side? or park on the left hand side?
people don't seem to agree on this one....


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 Post subject: Re: selfish people
Unread postPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 9:39 am 
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The printed regulations state "Park on the same side as the sighting"

I must add that at a sighting where there are a lot of cars building up we now tend to move on, I have seen too many pieces of tail light, reflector glass on the road to take a chance of "meeting" by accident.

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 Post subject: Re: selfish people
Unread postPosted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 6:43 pm 
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I believe there are two sides to this coin - and we have been on the receiving end of both.
At two lions kills on two consecutive days - the road was totally blocked.
The second kill happened in the morning and we had watched the action.
Late afternoon with so many people trying to get a good view we decided not to stop but carry on towards camp.
There was not a single gap for us to get through.
When a car moved we asked the people to please let us through.
We were given a filthy look - some rather nasty comments and the gap was quickly closed.
We had to drive off road to get past these inconsiderate people.
This was the umpteenth time in one trip that people were so scared we were trying to push in that they refused to budge one inch to let us through a totally blocked road.

On the other side of the coin
We were watching a Bateleur with his breakfast on the side of the road.
Not wanting to disturb him we stopped on the opposite side of the road and killed the engine - the next moment a vehicle came flying down the road - slammed on brakes - reversed - stopped directly in our line of view.
In a loud voice 'Dis net n voel' (my afrikaans not 2 good - "Its just a bird') accelerated off again .
Needless to say the Bateleur had taken to the air leaving his hard earned breakfast behind.

In all honesty it is easy to blame people for ruining a sighting - but we also need to leave space for the people who may not be interested in a lion sighting or whatever sighting has caused the traffic jam.
We also need to respect the people who want to watch "just a bird' and slow down before flying past them.

Instead of getting angry and frustrated we should set an example by being considerate and move on if a serious traffic jam is building up around us and at the same time respect a stopped vehicle - they may just be checking their map but they could well be looking at some bird or small creature we have not seen.

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 Post subject: Re: selfish people
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 31, 2010 11:42 am 
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Virtual Ranger
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Location: Pretoria
Sky wrote:
We also had a couple of irritating problems last weekend . Early Saturday morning found wild dogs in the road. We were third in line The guy in the front car was out the window taking pictures while still driving. The poor dogs just had to keep on running If they stopped he propably would have driven right over them. I got really irritated as did other people coming in the opposite direction. I eventually drove past and stopped in front of the guy and the dogs became calm and stood around doing what dogs do. Maybe the guy was just ignorant.


Had a similar experience.
I once came across a cheetah sighting on the Lower Sabie to Crocodile Bridge tar road.
There were about 25 or 30 vehicles basically chasing the poor cheetahs (2 of them) along the road.
It was about 35 degrees, very dry and very few prey around.
The cheetahs were panting, tired, and clearly trying to cross the road, but no one wanted to give them a chance.
I followed at the tail end of this for about 20 minutes.
At that time I drove a small Daihatsu Sirion (previous model), and I squeezed through the gaps that friendly people in the back of the pack left open for me with my small car (probably thinking that I can't see the cheetahs) until I was in front and then I parked across the road, blocking the very important "big cat spotters" who have been chasing the cats for at least 20 minutes and probably longer, thereby allowing the cheetahs to cross the road and go where they wanted to go.
Everybody in all of those vehicles probably felt I was rude and that I spoilt the sighting for them, but tough luck!
The cheetahs was surely grateful and that's all that matter to me!


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 Post subject: Re: selfish people
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 31, 2010 1:16 pm 
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We cannot run with the foxes and hut with the hounds.
The key is consideration for others.

Each person has a different idea of a great sighting.
For some it is lions and for others it is a Bateleur.
The person who says "Dis net 'n voel' and spoils a bird sighting for somebody else must not cry when a birder drives through his precious lion spot and they move off.

Being reasonable seems not to be an option to many.
They will hog a sighting all day and break the rules of keeping a lane open.
Do we then have the right to hoot to get through if reasonable behaviour is not successful?

I once spoilt a lion sighting by trying to be considerate and get out of the way and let others have the 'front row', but in inching past on the opposite side of the road, I disturbed the lions and they went into the bush.
I felt terrible and was told so by quite a few.
A few times while looking up a potential lifer, I have had it ruined by people who just race through without slowing down and are inconsiderate.

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 Post subject: Re: selfish people
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 31, 2010 3:16 pm 
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There are people who are happy to snap a pic of whatever it is that they're looking at as evidence and move on, but I go to Kruger to see more than just the animal,
I go to see their deeper behaviour and interactions, so I can stay at a sighting for hours if it satisfies my senses!
While I accommodate people who come along and wave down cars to tell them what I am looking at, it is not fair to expect me to leave a sighting I am enjoying by putting some sort of time limit on it!

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 Post subject: Re: selfish people
Unread postPosted: Tue Aug 31, 2010 4:11 pm 
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And so there we have it.
If you want to sit at a sighting for as long as you like, that's OK,
If someone else is not interested at that particular sighting for whatever reason and decides to move on carefully, surely that must also be OK.
Of course there is a possibility that his/her moving on, no matter how carefully, may disturb the sighting, but hey, that's his/her right to move on the same as it is someone else's right to stay put.
I think a lot depends on the attitudes of the people at the time, in the first post of this thread, the guy did say sorry, so I assume he didn't chase the animals on purpose, it was a result of him exercising his right.
What a dilemma :hmz:


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 Post subject: Re: selfish people
Unread postPosted: Thu Sep 30, 2010 11:36 pm 
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Wow this is such a difficult one!
Like some have admitted, I too have parked at a rhino sighting switched off been there for 20 min, started my car to drive off and caused them to get up and run off.
I was not a popular person at that sighting...
but what is one supposed to do?
No matter how good the sighting is, i have never moaned at someone for starting and leaving.
I have also been stuck in a lion traffic jam, behind a few cars.
I have a big car so I don't mind, but the people behind me can't see a thing!
Is that my fault as I have been told off many a time to put it mildly.
As far as speeding is concerned, and I know this may be wrong, but I usually just wander into the middle of the road just as the car is about to pass me, that usually causes them to slow down even if just for a short while.
Saying this though there is nothing worse than getting to a sighting and cars have completely blocked the road and refuse to move, especially when you honestly just want to get past and enjoy your drive!
We usually do just drive straight past if we can see a jam building, unless there is a Caracal or Pangolin, then I will park my big car where ever it fits and enjoy the sighting... -
my point is, everyone has their animal that they think entitles them to stop and look, no matter who they are bothering.
Statistically speaking I will probably never bother anyone, chances of me spotting caracal or pangolin long enough to build a jam, not gonna happen. :tongue:


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 Post subject: Viewing etiquette
Unread postPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 12:22 pm 
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On Sunday 09 September we were making our way back to Croc Bridge and were near Biyamiti - we didn't know that the S25 was still closed due to flood damage, and so didn't realize that instead of 17kms left to Croc Bridge, we were about to have to do a 60km detour - but that's another story.
Anyway we came round a corner and found an SUV parked facing us on the (their)right-hand side of the road. At the wheel was an elderly gentleman, seemingly intent on doing his Sudoku (or similar?) while his companion sat behind him taking photos with a very expensive-looking camera set-up.
The subject was a pride of some 8/9 lionesses plus juveniles.
We still don't know what the kill was.
Unfortunately they had the only spot from which one could see the lions/kill, they knew it and they weren't moving.
For the best part of 20 minutes, we drove forward, reversed, drove forward, reversed all to no avail - we just couldn't get even a half-decent look in - while this pair sat and Sudoku'd and photographed to their hearts' content, aware of our problem, but totally unperturbed.
We eventually gave up and had to drive on as the afternoon was drawing on - no sighting, no photos nothing! What would one expect from the average park visitor in this situation, what would be an acceptable course of action?

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